We Speak Methadone (and buprenorphine)

A NAMA Recovery Forum for Medication Assisted Treatment patients, family and advocates. (Issues or Questions about registration and/or the forum? Email zac@tnmethadone.org OR sapphirematthews@gmail.com)
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 Post subject: At least for me, methadone works; buprenorphine didnt.
PostPosted: Sun Jan 31, 2016 11:41 pm 
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Joined: Sat Jan 30, 2016 10:20 am
Posts: 1
I got a mean and threatening message from the moderator "amy" of suboxforums for posting the following on that website in a thread about methadone. I think its funny that a website that is supposed to be a helping resource is in the business of shilling a drug (bupe) that may not work as well for certain patients as other drugs (mthdn). Although after seeing suboxone billboards plastered all over every page on that website in banner ad form, it sort of makes sense.
"The following things i will present are either facts or well researched hypotheses.
Fact 1- suboxone gave me panic attacks. My suboxone prescribing doctor said it was not unheard of and he prescribed me zanax to deal with them. Zanax was a bitch to kick.
Fact 2- Suboxone made me feel as if I could not get a rush from exercising/doing anything that normally would make me feel good. I have talked to numerous MDs about this, and they believe my hypothesis (bupe's high affinity to the opioid receptors was leading to competitive antagonism of normal endorphin receptor activity) is very plausible. I have talked to many other people who have noticed the same effect. My suboxone prescribing doctor said he believed that this was a function of being on too high of a dose but I experienced this zombie effect at all doses.
Fact 3- Methadone worked for me because, as a full agonist, it provided me with the same feelings/effects that i was always pursuing during my years of using heroin, pills etc, although over a long timespan so you are never feeling too high or sedated. I have met people who love suboxone, although everybody at my methadone clinic says they could not tolerate it and they are happy to be on methadone now.
Fact 4- The kid who shot the elderly black people in church was on suboxone.
Fact 5- just because something is newer does not make it better. Asbestos replaced a non-carcinogenic substance. I am not equating bupe to asbestos but the point is obvious.
I am not trying to bash suboxone (buprenorphine) here.
I take issue with the pretentious belief that all addicts are stupid and dont know what is best for themselves. I take issue with the belief that an addicts pursuit of full agonists is somehow degenerate and we need smart doctors to help these stupid addicts by intervening and giving them something better. I take issue with the belief that something (partial agonist(buprenorphine)) that is unlike any naturally occuring neurotransmitter is better than something (full agonist(methadone))that does exactly the same thing to your opioid receptors that your body's own endorphins/enkephalins do when released due to exercise, eating spicy food, etc..."
If any of you all have any questions I will be happy to answer. If I seem irritated by the prospect of bupe continuing to be pushed more than methadone its because I am; I suffered for over a year on buprenorphine that almost led me to my death because all I ever read online was that methadone was just like suboxone, and I wish I had been presented with better info on the differences between the two drugs so I didnt have to suffer for so long.
All that being said, everybody is different. For many people buprenorphine works and if it works for you i suggest sticking with it. My main frustration stems from many people/doctors knowing buprenorphine was not working for me and not pushing me towards trying methadone.
Tchuss!


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 Post subject: Re: At least for me, methadone works; buprenorphine didnt.
PostPosted: Mon Feb 01, 2016 2:35 pm 
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Joined: Sun Oct 25, 2015 1:50 pm
Posts: 1
Greetings,

Thanks for your very informative post. I am currently on methadone and will soon have to decide whether I want to stay on it and pay out of pocket or transition to Suboxone which will be paid for under my insurance. It's a hard decision to make because I have used methadone on and off for more than 20 years and it has been a life saving miracle drug for me. When something works as good as it does I hate to stop using it. I think if I want Suboxone to work for me I can make it work for me. I just resent having to do so. Unfortunately my situation is not uncommon. A lot of us addicts are getting pushed around by the powers that be like the big pharm co.s, doctors that don't know enough about this issue, and insurance companies that will pay for one thing but not another.

So yeah, I feel like a lab rat in the hands of a bunch of incompetant idiots but there's not much I can do. I don't have a lot of money and have to take what I can get.

It won't be easy switching from 40 mg of methadone to Suboxone but I have read a lot about it and I know how to do it without causing too much pain. One way or another I will have to go into withdrawls. If not by putting myself into them then it will happen if I take the Sub too soon so either way it's not an easy switch. But long story short, once I make the switch I think Suboxone will work better for me just for the simple fact that the cost will be covered by my insurance and I won't have to go to a clinic every damn day to dose! That alone will make my life so much easier.

I have been reading everything I can from every person that posts on several formus about the difference between Suboxone and methadone. I want to make sure before I go through the hassle of switching that I know what I am getting into.

Thank you all for your input. It helps more than you know! Kepp on posting and I will do the same........all the best, megster


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 Post subject: Re: At least for me, methadone works; buprenorphine didnt.
PostPosted: Wed Feb 03, 2016 9:25 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jun 09, 2010 1:51 pm
Posts: 3
I am thinking that that if it aint broke dont fix it. I have been on methadone for about 8 or 9 years and I have no intention of getting off. I consider it to be my insulin!


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 Post subject: Re: At least for me, methadone works; buprenorphine didnt.
PostPosted: Thu Feb 04, 2016 4:20 pm 
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Joined: Sun May 04, 2014 9:54 pm
Posts: 196
Location: North Georgia
Bottom line: Everyone is different. Your experience is totally valid for YOU. And clearly methadone is a better choice for you. For others buprenorphine may be a better choice. I think that's what the medication-assisted treatment community needs to wrestle with, talk about and then ultimately ACCEPT. It doesn't sound like the moderator on the other site can accept that what is valid for you isn't necessarily valid for her...and that's just fine! WE need to support ALL the medications and treatment available for opioid addiction. The only thing we do know for SURE is that everyone is different! :)

_________________
Zac Talbott, CMA
Email | zac@tnmethadone.org

Chief Operating Officer | Counseling Solutions Treatment Centers
Comprehensive Opioid Treatment Programs
Program Director | Counseling Solutions Treatment Centers - Chatsworth


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 Post subject: Re: At least for me, methadone works; buprenorphine didnt.
PostPosted: Fri Feb 05, 2016 7:51 am 
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Joined: Fri Apr 26, 2013 7:09 am
Posts: 186
Different meds work differently for different people. I know people who have done amazingly on bupe, and others that have done amazing on methadone. Equally, bupe has not suited some people at all, and methadone does not work for everyone.

It's just a matter of trying it, and finding what works best for you.

Having said that, if you need a methadone dose in excess of 50/60mg, bupe is not always the best avenue for you, as it doesn't seem to 'satisfy' (for want of a better word) the opiate receptors, and does not seem to deal we well with cravings.

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Sapphire Matthews - MAR Patient Advocate
email:sapphirematthews@gmail.com

Please email me if you have any issues with the board, be that logging in, spammers, or anything else at all!!


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 Post subject: Re: At least for me, methadone works; buprenorphine didnt.
PostPosted: Fri Feb 05, 2016 2:32 pm 
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Joined: Sun May 04, 2014 9:54 pm
Posts: 196
Location: North Georgia
sapphire wrote:
Having said that, if you need a methadone dose in excess of 50/60mg, bupe is not always the best avenue for you, as it doesn't seem to 'satisfy' (for want of a better word) the opiate receptors, and does not seem to deal we well with cravings.



Important point.

_________________
Zac Talbott, CMA
Email | zac@tnmethadone.org

Chief Operating Officer | Counseling Solutions Treatment Centers
Comprehensive Opioid Treatment Programs
Program Director | Counseling Solutions Treatment Centers - Chatsworth


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